Forums/Z31P/z31-performance-upgrade-forums suspension-chassis-and-brakes/Trailing arm mods thread
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G-E: (2014-08-27 07:40:30)
Let's make this one the catch-all for everything us crazy people do to the trailing arms, I know russ84na will chime in soon, but here's my second iteration in the meantime…
Keep in mind this is the process I follow, sometimes I have designs in parallel going through their own evolution, ultimately to see which one is more favourable in the most important ways [archived image: smile.png]
This method would allow over 2 degrees of camber correction
1. The backing plate is small and high strength, with pre-welded studs in a 30x44mm rectangle pattern
2. The mid-plate is the one that gets welded to the arm where it's cut off, the cutline being around 4.25" from the ends
3. The clamping plate is slotted perpendicular to the mid-plate to allow a second axis of movement
4. The turnbuckle provides up to 15mm of extension at either pivot, but the arm can be cut and welded to bias any length change
v2plate-4.jpg
v2arm-3.jpg
v2arm-2.jpg
v2arm-1.jpg
G-E: (2014-08-27 09:14:10)
First and maybe more important iteration is below; the overall target user for this one is more advanced, it requires knowing specific goals…
[archived image: backing-plate-assembled.jpg]
The first thing you'll notice is there is no backing plate, the studs mount directly to the weld-on plate meaning you get more threads available (or to interfere) on the clamping side; the second thing is that because the studs are now fixed in pre-set positions, you have to know in advance what range of adjustment you need to be in
Since the clamping plates alone don't have as much fine adjustment as the slotted V2 style in the previous post, the stud positions give you a base offset to start from… this would give you over 3 degrees of correction!
Example 1: the middle hole positions are approximately 1 degrees of base camber correction, the clamping plate can allow a further half degree or so, which would be perfect for someone intending to reduce their camber from -2.5 to -1 or -1.5, which is a good street setting
Example 2: the bottom hole positions are approximately 3 degrees of base correction, you could then dial it back down with the clamping plate to reduce static camber from -3.5 or -4 to something more manageable
[archived image: camber-adjuster1.jpg]
[archived image: camber-adjuster2.jpg]
Of course gusseting on the back or top/bottom edges to the arm will be required, and I am working on including a pre-bent wrap around plate that can be used to box it in, if I can keep the costs where I want
If you were overly fond of gusseting, you could do it like this:
gussets.jpg
The overall kit consists of a ton of components:
[archived image: trailing-arm-proto-kit.jpg]
As you might also see the port holes in the arm allow you to retain the brake line bracket and pass it through normally, no bending or rerouting needed, unless they break (yay for corrosion!), but the upper cross bracing will have to be trimmed to clear the frame rail above it or removed entirely; in the meantime it will help with the welding
Another advantage to V1 would be the extreme trackwidth bias you could use, as there's nothing limiting arm placement on the plate (this equates to about 1.5" of track width increase per side, and would require axle spacers):
trailing-arm-max-width.jpg
PS. I would replicate the port holes on V2 as well, but for mockup it didn't seem important
shimmed-assemly.jpg
PPS. I'm having a run of shim plates (in 304SS) made to take up the gap between the backing plate and clamp plate for V1 here
adamvann3: (2014-08-27 13:54:40)
GE,
This keeps getting better. Please keep the updates coming. I have seen Russ's install and specifications. The opportunity is looking better with the feedback.
DeleriousZ: (2014-08-27 14:20:17)
Toe adjustment only basically. Seems to work ok.
SATAN: (2014-11-22 17:20:25)
GE, any updates on your kit? Do you have a rough price range you are thinking?
G-E: (2014-11-22 22:59:10)
Yea, waiting on the early adopters to give me proper feedback [archived image: smile.png]
But as it is, the kit will be in the range of $350+ship, with some optional components for a little extra…
SATAN: (2014-11-22 23:43:47)
Cool, I was debating on hacking apart my trailing arms this winter to gain some more positive camber. With my eccentric bolts maxed out, I'm still sitting at -.7 degrees.
Your kit looks very well made, but do you feel that your kit would be up to the task of holding the power I am putting down?
G-E: (2014-11-23 04:57:15)
You know I've been considering that very topic as of late, and the answer is, I don't know for sure… your torque figures are way beyond the norm, and with sticky tires, that can break many things already.
That said, I can make beefier turnbuckles and clamp plates without redesigning the rest, in your case that might be a good idea -- there would be some added cost, but if you're serious about a kit, I can make it happen [archived image: smile.png]
floridaZ: (2014-11-26 01:57:00)
I wonder if SATAN would fuck up the camber setting every time he launched… hmm…
G-E: (2014-11-27 06:47:37)
No because it would be like digging in your heels…
My only concern is excessive flex, premature fatiguing basically; it was designed with 400hp in mind, not 800
88Turbozx: (2014-11-30 06:39:16)
[archived image: _MG_3819_zps418ef327.jpg][archived image: _MG_3812_zps04c311b9.jpg]
NissanEgg: (2014-12-10 22:15:05)
In for updates!!
This is exactly what I had in mind for fixing these issues.
Any chance of being able to add a rubber boot/sock over the heim joint to prolong joint life?
G-E: (2014-12-11 00:14:07)
Shouldn't need to? You can mist them with light oil occasionally, but the injected nylon race doesn't need lube, and the body is quite rust resistant being cromoly (cromoly bonds well to surface treatments like zinc or nitriding)
That said, you can buy the generic rubber boot kits from any rodend place, part code is generally RERS-xx and will have several sizes -- I personally think it's a great way to trap moisture, sooo…
nismopu: (2014-12-12 17:15:49)
Shouldn't need to? You can mist them with light oil occasionally, but the injected nylon race doesn't need lube, and the body is quite rust resistant being cromoly (cromoly bonds well to surface treatments like zinc or nitriding)
That said, you can buy the generic rubber boot kits from any rodend place, part code is generally RERS-xx and will have several sizes -- I personally think it's a great way to trap moisture, sooo…
^ this
NissanEgg: (2014-12-15 00:03:20)
Any feedback yet?
What's the price for this?
Is this a cut/weld DIY or is there a fee for sending in the arms to you to be cut/welded?
I don't have a welder or means of making a jig to do it correctly, reason I am asking.
862sik: (2014-12-15 00:10:45)
I wonder if SATAN would fuck up the camber setting every time he launched… hmm…
Satan is a big boy. He will figure out what to reinforce LOL
G-E: (2014-12-15 02:55:44)
Is this a cut/weld DIY or is there a fee for sending in the arms to you to be cut/welded?
I am personally not providing a welding service, crossing borders with heavy shipments would make this totally outrageous, however if Andrew Gardner is up to it, he can do the east coast, I know Omron has a place in Cali that can do it…
I don't have a welder or means of making a jig to do it correctly, reason I am asking.
There's no jig required, assuming you can cut straight, you only have to make a lateral measurement for where you'd like to center, mainly because V1 can change your track width if you chose to
Of course I know all the instructions, but I just have too much stuff to do to finish making an install guide that covers every aspect
88Turbozx: (2014-12-15 18:11:27)
My welder doesn't really want to deal with shipping but I wouldn't mind bringing your arms to him if you ship them to me. Just make sure you clean the hell out of them or they will get sent right back to you lol.
floridaZ: (2014-12-16 02:39:45)
As long as that information gets circulated and incorporated into later revisions…
88Turbozx: (2014-12-16 06:54:54)
FYI my car is on the ground with everything installed. I cant comment on the ride yet since I'm waiting for brake lines to arrive. I'll let you know how static camber looks once I see it in the daytime, but this is only the "middle" setting of camber reduction and I'm probably sitting at around -2. At this same ride height with stock arms, I was sitting at -5.2 for reference. I'd say up to 5 degrees of camber adjustment can be achieved.
[archived image: 10419005_10204558484538785_609805891725501650_n_zpsf4592428.jpg]
[archived image: 10392289_10204558485738815_646501157006394375_n_zpsba32a4c2.jpg]
[archived image: 10616718_10204558486898844_4737873209502856445_n_zps84cb8237.jpg]
G-E: (2015-01-05 11:39:26)
So update from the horse's mouth:
I've more or less completed a proper manual for the V1 kit, details everything from installation to alignment afterwards, just waiting on feedback from more early adopters to see if I covered everything adequately.
In a side note, I'm going to see about including an adjuster wrench for the turnbuckles, I whipped up a design that requires lasercutting and bending, which would be nice, though the manufacturer might balk… so it's by no means final.
taw22tb.jpg
Meanwhile I'm also looking into producing gussets for the inboard end, again I'll have to see what my cutting crew have to say…
inner-gusset.jpg
NissanEgg: (2015-01-05 20:45:14)
Hurry up early installers!!! I want to know how these work out!!! I want some badly…
harwood909: (2015-02-05 01:04:23)
I just put all new poly in the RCA's and now I'm going to tear it all out once you offer these up. I ain't even mad. The pressure is on, get these things out!
G-E: (2015-02-05 05:33:52)
Thanks guys… ETA 2 more weeks
G-E: (2015-02-07 18:22:39)
I got pics of one of the converted s12 arms… notice they retained the hardlines
trailing arm jesse.jpg
harwood909: (2015-02-22 01:56:02)
Ohhhh it must be getting close. Any more feedback from the testies?
Rick88ss: (2015-02-22 03:21:36)
Dumb question maybe but what is the advantage of this setup vs the common drilling a hole for camber correction method?
Don't you need a little negative camber for proper handling?
G-E: (2015-02-22 04:05:37)
Ohhhh it must be getting close. Any more feedback from the testies?
Testies feel fine, just a little cold…
Lasercutter is backlogged, waiting for word :\
Dumb question maybe but what is the advantage of this setup vs the common drilling a hole for camber correction method?
Don't you need a little negative camber for proper handling?
Well you eliminate the bind-resisting bushings, so the more you need adjust, the more it helps you avoid tearing things off (or just tearing the bushings)
The other problem with slotting/drilling, is that by moving the outer pivot down, you move the spring perch down, which means the arm goes back up to meet the spring, and your toe gets worse…
With this you get full control over camber and toe, without making one or the other worse…
Rick88ss: (2015-02-22 04:56:43)
Very cool. That's what happened to me. My toe on one side is a little out of spec.
reddzx: (2015-02-22 05:03:56)
When will the complete ready to weld and install kit be available?
G-E: (2015-02-22 07:31:15)
Waiting on lasercutter… girl there said things got backed up and doesn't know if/when my stuff is ready to ship out…
G-E: (2015-03-07 20:37:42)
Sometime within the next 1-2wks I'll have the wrenches and inner gussets :\
1993gt40: (2015-04-01 02:14:20)
Put me down for one set. It will be going into a full on race car that races an endurance series. We do about 1,000 miles of full on hard road racing per event. IF there are any issues, we will find them.
G-E: (2015-04-01 05:31:24)
Very cool, Lemons?
reddzx: (2015-04-01 12:53:30)
Differences between V1 and V2?
G-E: (2015-04-01 18:22:04)
Back to Page 1 for you [archived image: smile.png]
G-E: (2015-04-01 22:32:16)
SALE THREAD HERE -->> http://z31performance.com/showthread…464#post370464